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Post by interestedridersfan on Feb 18, 2016 10:07:32 GMT
I repeat - there was a stats team present and they did the stats - they were there at the end still working at their position - they did amongst other thing provide the MVP data. Since arriving home at 23.00 - over three hours have been spent - producing a workable set of stats - getting them to the organisations and the league and investigating the issues which caused the problem. So it is still annoying that no word of apology is offered for the various falsehoods expressed in this thread. Meanwhile anyone interested in last night's stats can approach the stats team at Riders on Saturday for a printout as we are the same people who worked yesterday at Sheffield. Isn't the criticism at the BBL for not having the correct computer links/software working? Or the venue? Fact is whoever fault it is there were no stats on the night and I just checked and there are still no stats It's clearly not your fault But something didn't work It's not the end of the world but people are bound to point it out when they go looking for the stats and they aren't there Regardless of who's at fault. Out of interest - what could be done different so you don't face that situation again? Couldnt they give you generic software on your own laptop etc as a backup that you could email across after the event rather than have to write down? And you would print as normal at the end of a game?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 18, 2016 10:20:52 GMT
Are you able to put something up here at all?
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Post by SEB on Feb 18, 2016 10:43:28 GMT
IRF - I vowed to myself I would not post on here to reply to you again, as I think every fan has a right to support their team as they choose and I don't want to be a damp squib on any fans enthusiasm....but you did just have to start on my folks didn't you so here I am! ? Sharks have a stats computer set up that different people (including me at one point) do the stats on each game. This game it stopped working for sone unknown reason. Every way stats people know of to correct it they did, and it just wasn't working. Therefore the back up was to do the game on paper, this is standard practice if the computer breaks. In answer to your question - Yes in hindsight maybe this is something the whole league could learn from and there could be a mandate that all clubs need a back up computer onsite, just like now it is a mandate that all clubs SHOULD have spare backboards onsite after Jason Siemon broke the Riders Granby Halls with a dunk in the mid 90s, but whether they do I don't know, and whether that is overkill seeing as I've never seen or heard of it happening since then is a question of risk. I honestly don't think this was Sharks fault, just something that happened and the people there on the day did their best. I think the statement that was seen as a falsehood is "there was nobody there to do stats and no stats available for the coaches to use at the end of each quarter" and that wasn't true. Both coaches got to see the stats in a crude format, which is probably very much like every non-BBL coach sees their stats, and Rob and Atiba are experienced enough to use them. So although it wasn't ideal, it worked given the situation that was unexpected and a "twist of fate" for want of a better word! Hope that clarifies things, I can assure you that the appropriate expertise dealt with the situation the best way possible! My folks don't eat hotdogs but if you have any other peace-offerings they will be statting the Riders game on Saturday! ?
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Post by SEB on Feb 18, 2016 10:46:25 GMT
Ok that post destroyed my face things and put How rude! Lol I will try to post sone using my limited computer skills, please have patience lol!
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Post by interestedridersfan on Feb 18, 2016 10:56:45 GMT
IRF - I vowed to myself I would not post on here to reply to you again, as I think every fan has a right to support their team as they choose and I don't want to be a damp squid on any fans enthusiasm....but you did just have to start on my folks didn't you so here I am! ? Sharks have a stats computer set up that different people (including me at one point) do the stats on each game. This game it stopped working for sone unknown reason. Every way stats people know of to correct it they did, and it just wasn't working. Therefore the back up was to do the game on paper, this is standard practice if the computer breaks. In answer to your question - Yes in hindsight maybe this is something the whole league could learn from and there could be a mandate that all clubs need a back up computer onsite, just like now it is a mandate that all clubs SHOULD have spare backboards onsite after Jason Siemon broke the Riders Granby Halls with a dunk in the mid 90s, but whether they do I don't know, and whether that is overkill seeing as I've never seen or heard of it happening since then is a question of risk. I honestly don't think this was Sharks fault, just something that happened and the people there on the day did their best. I think the statement that was seen as a falsehood is "there was nobody there to do stats and no stats available for the coaches to use at the end of each quarter" and that wasn't true. Both coaches got to see the stats in a crude format, which is probably very much like every non-BBL coach sees their stats, and Rob and Atiba are experienced enough to use them. So although it wasn't ideal, it worked given the situation that was unexpected and a "twist of fate" for want of a better word! Hope that clarifies things, I can assure you that the appropriate expertise dealt with the situation the best way possible! My folks don't eat hotdogs but if you have any other peace-offerings they will be statting the Riders game on Saturday! ? Basically we travelled down with some other fans on the team coach as happens for all Riders away games (they allow supporters on the coach to help cover costs) Clearly we knew there were no livestats on the night After the game the coaches normally have stats on printouts and you can ask to look at them And when we asked they said there aren't any So to be fair what I said was exactly what I was told and to be fair their reply was correct as well other than if they had gone and copied them all out Don't shoot the messenger just passed on what we were told I would have thought there could be a version on the computer or even an iPad you guys use of what you do that doesn't need live links or wifi and would effectively accept your inputting but just not live And would be a better option for you than having to go manual That they could provide for you so you aren't relying on backups at each venue? If I had to do your job I think I'd take my own backup as the paper option doenst sound very easy
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Feb 18, 2016 11:04:52 GMT
IRF - I vowed to myself I would not post on here to reply to you again, as I think every fan has a right to support their team as they choose and I don't want to be a damp squid on any fans enthusiasm....but you did just have to start on my folks didn't you so here I am! ? Sharks have a stats computer set up that different people (including me at one point) do the stats on each game. This game it stopped working for sone unknown reason. Every way stats people know of to correct it they did, and it just wasn't working. Therefore the back up was to do the game on paper, this is standard practice if the computer breaks. In answer to your question - Yes in hindsight maybe this is something the whole league could learn from and there could be a mandate that all clubs need a back up computer onsite, just like now it is a mandate that all clubs SHOULD have spare backboards onsite after Jason Siemon broke the Riders Granby Halls with a dunk in the mid 90s, but whether they do I don't know, and whether that is overkill seeing as I've never seen or heard of it happening since then is a question of risk. I honestly don't think this was Sharks fault, just something that happened and the people there on the day did their best. I think the statement that was seen as a falsehood is "there was nobody there to do stats and no stats available for the coaches to use at the end of each quarter" and that wasn't true. Both coaches got to see the stats in a crude format, which is probably very much like every non-BBL coach sees their stats, and Rob and Atiba are experienced enough to use them. So although it wasn't ideal, it worked given the situation that was unexpected and a "twist of fate" for want of a better word! Hope that clarifies things, I can assure you that the appropriate expertise dealt with the situation the best way possible! My folks don't eat hotdogs but if you have any other peace-offerings they will be statting the Riders game on Saturday! ? Welcome to the new board
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Post by SEB on Feb 18, 2016 11:19:34 GMT
Ok someone really needs to show me where the Edit button cos I put squid not squib and my clever father has pointed this out, argh!!!
Stats:
Brownell - 1 missed 3, 1 of 2 freethrows, 3 fouls Brooks - 10 of 21 shooting, 3 of 3 freethrows, 2 boards, 5 assists, 2 turnovers Hogg - 2 of 6 shooting including 2 of 4 from the 3, 1 of 2 freethrows, 1 board, 3 turnovers, 2 fouls Tuck - 3 of 6 shooting including 1 made 3, 1 of 2 freethrows, 1 assist, 3 turnovers, 3 steals, 1 block, 2 fouls Horseman - 1 of 4 shooting, 3 boards, 2 fouls Barber - 3 of 7 shooting, 6 boards, 1 assist, 1 turnover, 1 block Sing - 0 of 2 from the 3, 3 boards, 3 fouls Robinson - 2 of 5 shooting, 2 of 2 from the freethrow line, 7 boards, 4 turnovers, 1 foul Odister - 7 of 13 shooting including 3 of 8 from the 3, 1 board, 3 assists, 1 turnover, 1 steal, 2 fouls
Bernardini - 5 of 11 shooting with 1 of 7 from the 3, 7 boards, 1 turnover, 1 steal, 1 block, 1 foul Watson - 6 of 11 shooting with 3 of 5 from the 3, 3 of 4 freethrows, 3 boards, 3 assists, 2 turnovers, 1 foul Walker - 2 of 3 shooting, 1 of 2 freethrows, 4 boards, 1 assist, 2 turnovers, 1 steal, 1 foul Sullivan - 3 of 9 shooting, 4 of 4 freethrows, 4 boards, 3 turnovers, 1 steal, 2 fouls Washington - 3 of 4 shooting, 1 of 1 freethrows, 1 board, 4 assists, 1 turnover, 2 steals, 3 fouls Anderson - 3 of 3 shooting, 2 boards, 2 turnovers, 1 steal, 1 foul Wright - 5 of 9 shooting including 1 made 3, 2 of 3 freethrows, 10 boards, 4 assists, 1 steal, 3 fouls Gruis - 2 of 5 shooting, 2 boards, 4 assists, 1 steal, 3 fouls
Everyone else did not play.
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Post by SEB on Feb 18, 2016 11:24:48 GMT
IRF - I took a photo of them on my phone, as did sharks, Rob decided not to, that's on him, I don't blame him either he knew he was going to get them written up.
If you know of any way to keep a record that is easier than manual, the back up the whole league use, please email Andy Webb to inform us.
The words you are looking for are, "My bad, I misunderstood the situation from the information I had", and my reply would've been, "no problem, easily done!".
Anyway after the trauma of typing all those stats up I am now going to go traumatise my god daughter by doing her hair!
Hope these stats help!
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Post by interestedridersfan on Feb 18, 2016 21:03:00 GMT
IRF - I took a photo of them on my phone, as did sharks, Rob decided not to, that's on him, I don't blame him either he knew he was going to get them written up. If you know of any way to keep a record that is easier than manual, the back up the whole league use, please email Andy Webb to inform us. The words you are looking for are, "My bad, I misunderstood the situation from the information I had", and my reply would've been, "no problem, easily done!". Anyway after the trauma of typing all those stats up I am now going to go traumatise my god daughter by doing her hair! Hope these stats help! Well done for getting the stats done under difficult circumstances Seb My bad I misunderstood the info! And thanks for taking so much time to type up those stats. That's beyond the call of duty!
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Post by dyb dyb on Feb 19, 2016 11:41:42 GMT
I think part of this thread proves you've got to be careful when quoting or even just referring to what players/coaches say or discuss. They are undoubtedly very passionate people who will favour their own clubs but will also in turn have some one sided opinions. These can be very very easily taken out of context or interpreted the wrong way. e.g. Rob not given a print out of stats. This as been used to have a go either at the sharks, the stats people/bbl or both. Did he add that he was given manual stats or an option to take a pic. Also quotes from players can be read differently and people using them seen as thinking the same or supporting what as been said, as in using other peoples words to say what you really think.
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Post by massiveridersfan on Feb 19, 2016 14:57:40 GMT
Probably best not to quote players or coaches directly when they make comments privately (on the travel coach) in a public forum. I think the ability to chat to/with players on the coach to and from games is great but I think it's a little unfair to quote them. We all say things sometimes that we wouldn't like published. Think they deserve a little privacy.
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retsek
6th Man
Global moderator
Posts: 449
Favourite Team: Sheffield Sharks
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Post by retsek on Feb 19, 2016 15:49:14 GMT
Ok so the positives first. At least Leicester will beat Newcastle in the final, we would have lost by around 8 to 12 points depending on how the standard 'foul to catch up' played out, so in reality this game didn't make any difference on the overall trophy count for us.
I was pleased we didn't drop our heads going 16 down late in the third, especially in such a low scoring game we could have capitulated, so being able to bring it back to as close as 4 with plenty of time left took plenty of character.
It's reassuring to see Oddister display the skill set he showed Wednesday. Too often he's played anything as low as 2-5 minutes, never gets a chance to showcase anything, and is little more then an also ran. When you're rotating 9 players it can be difficult to make your mark, so after a solid showing against the best team in the league, I'm hoping it will convince Atiba to run him ahead of Brownell in the rotations.
So for the negatives, in 22 years of watching the BBL, I can't recall ever watching an official mouth off and react to fans from the court at half time (although I welcome and will chuckle at any anecdotes people have)!??! Just a staggering lack of professionalism from one of the worse officials (the woman, don't know her name) we have in our league. It's also worth noting before I go any further that the woeful officiating didn't favour either team, so is not meant as an excuse for the defeat. With that said, all players (and fans) look for is consistency - not even for the whole season, just call a game the same in quarter one as you do quarter four. The problem with Wednesday was, they were letting massive amounts of physical contact go at both ends (which was fine as both were doing it) but then were blowing the most innocuous contact calls as if it was just to put a number or two on the board. This causes massive frustration for fans, players and coaches - how do you coach a game and manage rotations when you don't know what level of physicality is going to be penalised?
We did not do our recent style of offence justice in any way shape or form. We seemed to regress back to pass and stand, or hero ball (not to blame Brooks, he dragged us back into the game fuelled by frustration, and thankfully has the ability to score tough shots like he was making in the third). Where were the back door cuts, screens and baseline cuts that had become a staple during our winning streak? Yes we played it in patches, but at best I'd say 15-20%? The rest of our points were from broken plays, offensive rebounds, or one on one basketball (i.e. the rubbish we watched at the start of the season).
Our defence was.... confusing I think is the best word. I can vividly remember four truly awful half court, wide open layups right down the middle that we conceded in the first half, no help D and no recovery, but yet at other times our recovery to the ball, especially during parts of the second half where the ball was zipping across the Leicester 3 point line, was outstanding. Just a pity we couldn't stick together enough of our good play at either end to get over the hump.
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Post by blueskies99 on Feb 19, 2016 16:58:37 GMT
Anyone know if the game was filmed and if so, is it available?
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Post by isthaturinal on Feb 19, 2016 17:27:41 GMT
Probably best not to quote players or coaches directly when they make comments privately (on the travel coach) in a public forum. I think the ability to chat to/with players on the coach to and from games is great but I think it's a little unfair to quote them. We all say things sometimes that we wouldn't like published. Think they deserve a little privacy. Totally agree Massiveridersfan, Many a time I've travelled on the Riders coach to away games and have heard/been told stories about other clubs and other players most of which I would not dream of posting on here, Like you said its a private conversation and should stay that way
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sharkz
Bench Player
Posts: 162
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Post by sharkz on Feb 19, 2016 17:31:34 GMT
The refs were being assessed on Wednesday night, Retsek. It didn't seem to make any difference, I wondered if they knew!
The match was filmed, but there seems to be a delay on posting them at the moment. They do seem to be catching up a bit, though.
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Post by interestedridersfan on Feb 19, 2016 17:45:33 GMT
Ok so the positives first. At least Leicester will beat Newcastle in the final, we would have lost by around 8 to 12 points depending on how the standard 'foul to catch up' played out, so in reality this game didn't make any difference on the overall trophy count for us. I was pleased we didn't drop our heads going 16 down late in the third, especially in such a low scoring game we could have capitulated, so being able to bring it back to as close as 4 with plenty of time left took plenty of character. It's reassuring to see Oddister display the skill set he showed Wednesday. Too often he's played anything as low as 2-5 minutes, never gets a chance to showcase anything, and is little more then an also ran. When you're rotating 9 players it can be difficult to make your mark, so after a solid showing against the best team in the league, I'm hoping it will convince Atiba to run him ahead of Brownell in the rotations. So for the negatives, in 22 years of watching the BBL, I can't recall ever watching an official mouth off and react to fans from the court at half time (although I welcome and will chuckle at any anecdotes people have)!??! Just a staggering lack of professionalism from one of the worse officials (the woman, don't know her name) we have in our league. It's also worth noting before I go any further that the woeful officiating didn't favour either team, so is not meant as an excuse for the defeat. With that said, all players (and fans) look for is consistency - not even for the whole season, just call a game the same in quarter one as you do quarter four. The problem with Wednesday was, they were letting massive amounts of physical contact go at both ends (which was fine as both were doing it) but then were blowing the most innocuous contact calls as if it was just to put a number or two on the board. This causes massive frustration for fans, players and coaches - how do you coach a game and manage rotations when you don't know what level of physicality is going to be penalised? We did not do our recent style of offence justice in any way shape or form. We seemed to regress back to pass and stand, or hero ball (not to blame Brooks, he dragged us back into the game fuelled by frustration, and thankfully has the ability to score tough shots like he was making in the third). Where were the back door cuts, screens and baseline cuts that had become a staple during our winning streak? Yes we played it in patches, but at best I'd say 15-20%? The rest of our points were from broken plays, offensive rebounds, or one on one basketball (i.e. the rubbish we watched at the start of the season). Our defence was.... confusing I think is the best word. I can vividly remember four truly awful half court, wide open layups right down the middle that we conceded in the first half, no help D and no recovery, but yet at other times our recovery to the ball, especially during parts of the second half where the ball was zipping across the Leicester 3 point line, was outstanding. Just a pity we couldn't stick together enough of our good play at either end to get over the hump. Your analysis of what went wrong is excellent IMO This is why I don't think Sharks will win tonight. Hope I am wrong. Brooks can play heroball in spells but not all night Eagles are a clever team and I'm sure Sharks will push them but not have the right plan to beat them at end of the day
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Post by interestedridersfan on Feb 19, 2016 17:50:54 GMT
Probably best not to quote players or coaches directly when they make comments privately (on the travel coach) in a public forum. I think the ability to chat to/with players on the coach to and from games is great but I think it's a little unfair to quote them. We all say things sometimes that we wouldn't like published. Think they deserve a little privacy. Totally agree Massiveridersfan, Many a time I've travelled on the Riders coach to away games and have heard/been told stories about other clubs and other players most of which I would not dream of posting on here, Like you said its a private conversation and should stay that way
Totally agree as well. I've got loads of stuff I could post that's way more interesting than anything I've ever posted on here but wouldn't as it would drop people in the shxt if I did. But posting that there weren't any stats on the night (which is technically correct despite the fact that SEB did their best to produce some) I don't think is divulging anyone's confidence And saying that one of our players said how come Tuck is such a **** on the court but so nice after I didn't think anyone would get in a drama about. Anything I thought would cause a problem to anyone or a drama I would never pass on. Now every other forum ive been on involving sports would normally kill to find out anything anybody knew about anything and if nobody heard anything they just make stuff up anyway about stuff So in that respect it's good on here Not much gets said and people don't make stuff up either A bit more boring but civilised and respectful
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Post by isthaturinal on Feb 19, 2016 18:06:36 GMT
Retsek, you've got to be talking about Kate...... I remember her reffing at JSSC and she was awful and not for the first time, I shouted at her "Kate, please get another hobby, the rest of us are trying to take this serious"
If looks could kill, I would not be posting here now......
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Post by interestedridersfan on Feb 19, 2016 18:15:28 GMT
Retsek, you've got to be talking about Kate...... I remember her reffing at JSSC and she was awful and not for the first time, I shouted at her "Kate, please get another hobby, the rest of us are trying to take this serious"
If looks could kill, I would not be posting here now......
And there's a perfect example of how I would drop several people in the shxt if I even posted a tiny fraction of what was said on the coach about the above But I can say personally that any ref of any sport who delights in jumping in the air excitedly to point their arm in favour of the home team (wherever that may be) knowing how it's going to result in loud cheers from the home crowd shouldn't be reffing. Just point normally. When she gave a later decision to us she did just point normally and without the razzamatazz knowing that the crowd aren't going to jump in unison in excitement with her It's like she was delighted to give a home decision and sorry to have to give an away decision I'm respectful to refs in general providing they don't think they are the star of the show The best refs in any sport you don't even notice they are there
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retsek
6th Man
Global moderator
Posts: 449
Favourite Team: Sheffield Sharks
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Post by retsek on Feb 19, 2016 18:47:48 GMT
I shouted at her "Kate, please get another hobby, the rest of us are trying to take this serious" That's quality!! I'd never have anything that witty to shout!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 19, 2016 18:54:49 GMT
I can only read that in an Alan Partridge voice.
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