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Post by Deleted on Jan 26, 2020 4:24:47 GMT
Shouldn't have answered any questions, made yourself look even more like a fraud.
Half the answers you simply dont know the answer to
Others you just guess based on what everyone in uk basketball think
You pretended you couldve been Sawyer when someone suggested the name is similar to his company now you refer to Sawyer as another person.
Get a life and stop pretending to be someone you're not
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Post by notoriousbigz on Jan 26, 2020 7:36:33 GMT
China doesnt abide by EU law tho, england does/did. Absolutely clueless This doesnt make any sense. If they were required to sign a register in their own country, they'd be arrested for not doing so irrespective of where in the world it was they went. China also has a specific extradition pact with Lithuania (strangely), so theyd be turfed back by the authorities on request if theyd done anything wrong. |
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Post by abcd123 on Jan 26, 2020 7:46:44 GMT
Shouldn't have answered any questions, made yourself look even more like a fraud. Half the answers you simply dont know the answer to Others you just guess based on what everyone in uk basketball think You pretended you couldve been Sawyer when someone suggested the name is similar to his company now you refer to Sawyer as another person. Get a life and stop pretending to be someone you're not I didn't pretend I could be Jon. The 'maybe' was that my username was in reference to the company name. You chose to take that a different way. Ultimately, believe what you want. You're not prepared to accept anything I say, that's fine by me. You've figured out your own version of events based on what everyone thinks, that's fine. I mean, it's largely wrong, but it's fine. I'm happy to leave it there, you don't seem to want to know what really happened, so there's no reason for me to keep talking. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 26, 2020 8:10:39 GMT
China doesnt abide by EU law tho, england does/did. Absolutely clueless This doesnt make any sense. If they were required to sign a register in their own country, they'd be arrested for not doing so irrespective of where in the world it was they went. China also has a specific extradition pact with Lithuania (strangely), so theyd be turfed back by the authorities on request if theyd done anything wrong. I was told they were not allowed in england for 7 days at a time and had to sign in in their own country to prove they weren't here |
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Post by notoriousbigz on Jan 26, 2020 8:12:46 GMT
This doesnt make any sense. If they were required to sign a register in their own country, they'd be arrested for not doing so irrespective of where in the world it was they went. China also has a specific extradition pact with Lithuania (strangely), so theyd be turfed back by the authorities on request if theyd done anything wrong. I was told they were not allowed in england for 7 days at a time and had to sign in in their own country to prove they weren't here I dont know whos told you that but I think theyre probably a little confused as to how the system works. |
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Post by notoriousbigz on Jan 26, 2020 8:15:03 GMT
Shouldn't have answered any questions, made yourself look even more like a fraud. Half the answers you simply dont know the answer to Others you just guess based on what everyone in uk basketball think You pretended you couldve been Sawyer when someone suggested the name is similar to his company now you refer to Sawyer as another person. Get a life and stop pretending to be someone you're not I didn't pretend I could be Jon. The 'maybe' was that my username was in reference to the company name. You chose to take that a different way. Ultimately, believe what you want. You're not prepared to accept anything I say, that's fine by me. You've figured out your own version of events based on what everyone thinks, that's fine. I mean, it's largely wrong, but it's fine. I'm happy to leave it there, you don't seem to want to know what really happened, so there's no reason for me to keep talking. What does interest me is once shire had gone, who was it giving the advice to sawyer about how to run it from there on out? Because the model didnt seem to change all that much - Saunders, Lawrence, Lavs all wont have come cheap and the model already hadnt worked. |
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Post by faz on Jan 26, 2020 10:15:44 GMT
Shouldn't have answered any questions, made yourself look even more like a fraud. Half the answers you simply dont know the answer to Others you just guess based on what everyone in uk basketball think You pretended you couldve been Sawyer when someone suggested the name is similar to his company now you refer to Sawyer as another person. Get a life and stop pretending to be someone you're not I didn't pretend I could be Jon. The 'maybe' was that my username was in reference to the company name. You chose to take that a different way. Ultimately, believe what you want. You're not prepared to accept anything I say, that's fine by me. You've figured out your own version of events based on what everyone thinks, that's fine. I mean, it's largely wrong, but it's fine. I'm happy to leave it there, you don't seem to want to know what really happened, so there's no reason for me to keep talking. You’ve nit actually said that much that was t already known / assumed Shire had a nice dream talked a lot of bollox which Sawyer bought literally. Appointed a rookie coach on sily money. Probably paid Tony G silly money. Sacks the coach broke player contracts, sacked Shire . Took a coach out of a job and continued to sign players without the funds or business plan to support it They say talk is cheap but with regard to the London City Royals it was ****ing expensive. Really hope all employees ex Riyals can pay their mortgage and buy food. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 26, 2020 10:57:02 GMT
From the outside I think Bigz summary seems spot on. I don't believe anyone is pleased that Royals have folded leaving players and staff unemployed and fans without their team. This would include Hersey whom I guess is just pleased to have acquired a player who should shine in the EBL and keep Leopards in div 1 next year. This doesn't assume he's happy about the circumstances. Indeed. I'd like Palace to have a successful, thriving basketball club. There's certainly room for them in London. But i'd like the club to honour its commitments made to players and generally behave responsibly. Because it's tough for properly run clubs to compete for players when other clubs are giving players contracts they have no chance of honouring. As mentioned by someone else in this thread, Shire's departure didn't stop Royals offering deals they couldn't afford. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 26, 2020 11:08:46 GMT
Congratulations on the W. How did Orlan play? Any increase in attendance? Cheers. He's gonna' be a beast. I've waffled here. Crowd was up a bit, despite Hemel being at home. When we win our final nine games, finish eighth and win at Solent in the play-offs, we'll probably have to bring in extra seating for the semi-final. Probably. |
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Post by sussexbantam on Jan 26, 2020 22:45:42 GMT
From the outside I think Bigz summary seems spot on. I don't believe anyone is pleased that Royals have folded leaving players and staff unemployed and fans without their team. This would include Hersey whom I guess is just pleased to have acquired a player who should shine in the EBL and keep Leopards in div 1 next year. This doesn't assume he's happy about the circumstances. Indeed. I'd like Palace to have a successful, thriving basketball club. There's certainly room for them in London. But i'd like the club to honour its commitments made to players and generally behave responsibly. Because it's tough for properly run clubs to compete for players when other clubs are giving players contracts they have no chance of honouring. As mentioned by someone else in this thread, Shire's departure didn't stop Royals offering deals they couldn't afford. Exactly this - we all want a second team in London - but its not fair that they sign players they can't afford and use that advantage to win trophies. And its even more unfair if they try to repeat that trick in the second season. I'm sorry for their fans that they've gone but you simply can't run a business like this. |
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Post by LTFan on Jan 27, 2020 13:23:01 GMT
Indeed. I'd like Palace to have a successful, thriving basketball club. There's certainly room for them in London. But i'd like the club to honour its commitments made to players and generally behave responsibly. Because it's tough for properly run clubs to compete for players when other clubs are giving players contracts they have no chance of honouring. As mentioned by someone else in this thread, Shire's departure didn't stop Royals offering deals they couldn't afford. Exactly this - we all want a second team in London - but its not fair that they sign players they can't afford and use that advantage to win trophies. And its even more unfair if they try to repeat that trick in the second season. I'm sorry for their fans that they've gone but you simply can't run a business like this. But only if it’s viable. I want a London rivalry as much as the next person (I loved the Towers/Leopards days), but one of the things this ‘experiment’ has perhaps shown us is that 2 teams in the same city might not be viable right now. I’d much rather a single successful, financially stable, sustainable London team than two struggling ones. |
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Post by connors on Jan 27, 2020 14:05:48 GMT
London is plenty big enough to support two BBL Teams from a fan perspective. I think there are challenges that relate to the cost base though. As we all know London Weighting exists for a reason!
I think with Lions being based in the East something in the South or West could be workable in the right circumstances with a sustainable set up. The Royals way of doing things did not work and in the past Capitals failed too (possibly other end of the scale?). Could the Cavaliers ever get to BBL level? Despite the Thames Valley moniker they actually play in Uxbridge don't they?
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Post by LTFan on Jan 27, 2020 15:52:31 GMT
London is plenty big enough to support two BBL Teams from a fan perspective. I think there are challenges that relate to the cost base though. As we all know London Weighting exists for a reason! I think with Lions being based in the East something in the South or West could be workable in the right circumstances with a sustainable set up. The Royals way of doing things did not work and in the past Capitals failed too (possibly other end of the scale?). Could the Cavaliers ever get to BBL level? Despite the Thames Valley moniker they actually play in Uxbridge don't they? I’m not entirely convinced. Despite their best efforts Lions struggle to get crowds bigger than 2,000 – and from my experience a lot of those people are coming from all across London, not just East London. I’m not sure it would be possible for another London team to get crowds of another 2,000 people. It feels like Lions are already pretty much exhausting the available London market. |
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Post by connors on Jan 27, 2020 19:07:52 GMT
Population of London currently around 9m......there will be enough fans if it’s done properly but it cannot happen overnight.
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Post by ko25 on Jan 27, 2020 19:19:21 GMT
Population of London currently around 9m......there will be enough fans if it’s done properly but it cannot happen overnight. That's the thing though isn't if it's done right look how many times it hasn't. |
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Post by reallyoldfeenixfan on Jan 27, 2020 20:39:19 GMT
Doesn't matter how well something is put together, it looks like a major issue is somewhere to play the games. I'm a very long way away up here but how many suitably sized places are there to host BBL basketball in and close to London?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 27, 2020 21:50:20 GMT
Shocking no one here cites the fact the basketball product is just not good and the events lack entertainment value. With neither, how do you expect people to come? 8 million people in London and not even the Lions can crack 1000 a game? It’s not the sport, it’s the product. Plain and simple.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 27, 2020 22:30:05 GMT
I thought you were completely done with British basketball? What made you return?
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Post by ko25 on Jan 27, 2020 22:48:13 GMT
Shocking no one here cites the fact the basketball product is just not good and the events lack entertainment value. With neither, how do you expect people to come? 8 million people in London and not even the Lions can crack 1000 a game? It’s not the sport, it’s the product. Plain and simple. Lacks entertainment value? Tickets are dirt cheap you're getting value for money easily. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 27, 2020 23:01:02 GMT
Shocking no one here cites the fact the basketball product is just not good and the events lack entertainment value. With neither, how do you expect people to come? 8 million people in London and not even the Lions can crack 1000 a game? It’s not the sport, it’s the product. Plain and simple. Go on, give us your suggestions. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 27, 2020 23:12:18 GMT
Shocking no one here cites the fact the basketball product is just not good and the events lack entertainment value. With neither, how do you expect people to come? 8 million people in London and not even the Lions can crack 1000 a game? It’s not the sport, it’s the product. Plain and simple. How's life under the bridge? A bit nippy , I guess |
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Post by LTFan on Jan 28, 2020 13:26:30 GMT
Population of London currently around 9m......there will be enough fans if it’s done properly but it cannot happen overnight. But as we’ve said before, just because London has the largest population doesn’t mean it’s easier to attract crowds. It also has the largest competition in terms of ‘things’ competing for you to spend your hard earned money on. Some of the most successful BBL teams are in locations with relatively small populations, but with much less competition in terms of things to do. It’s all relative. |
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Post by connors on Jan 28, 2020 14:13:24 GMT
That's a fair comment LTFan.
Reallyoldfeenixfan also raises a point that there is a lack of suitable BBL size venues and I get that. HOwever I do still believe fundamentally that a club could make a second BBL franchise in London work. Clearly would not be easy and perhaps not financially worthwhile either.
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Post by saintpat on Jan 28, 2020 15:25:08 GMT
I think LTFan raises a very valid point regarding the fanbase in London & spreading so thin.
However Lions were managing very good numbers in Crystal Palace by the end of our first year there & I don't think we brought many fans from there to the Copper Box when we moved. I'd say the people going were in a large percentage local people, which is totally different to the crowds at the Copper Box.
I think if we'd stayed in CP we would have built up a far more consistent fanbase who would have been 'fans' rather than spectators. The numbers wouldn't be as large as we get at the Box but we would have had a far larger loyal fanbase than we have now.
Therefore I think a team at CP could generate a decent following without impacting Lions. Lions didn't promise anything but BBL basketball at Crystal Palace & kept prices to a level where families & individuals could come without impacting on their other London activities too greatly.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 29, 2020 10:15:22 GMT
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