Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 20, 2019 14:59:26 GMT
To get bums on seats you've got to have true basketball fans. Not people who like the sport. That takes decades to build. People dont realise its usually a 2nd generation fan that becomes a life long fan. I'm off the watch league 2 football tonight and shocked its cost me £20 and I camt even have a beer while I watch
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Post by sussexbantam on Aug 20, 2019 15:14:36 GMT
To get bums on seats you've got to have true basketball fans. Not people who like the sport. That takes decades to build. People dont realise its usually a 2nd generation fan that becomes a life long fan. I'm off the watch league 2 football tonight and shocked its cost me £20 and I camt even have a beer while I watch £25 for Stevenage against Bradford tonight...and given the standard of football some alcohol as anaesthetic would also be good...
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 20, 2019 15:51:47 GMT
I agree the instability's a major issue. However, I am genuinely baffled why the BBL doesn't attract more spectators when huge numbers of kids play the sport at school. They'll watch football (doesn't need to be anywhere NEAR Premier league standard) but won't shell out a paltry £12 or so to see competitive basketball. I was hooked the first time I watched Riders (Planters/Walkers as was then) but attracting bums on seats is so difficult it leaves me really at a loss to explain it. I know it's old ground and lots have given reasons on this forum but it is my biggest source of disappointment. I'd love to see basketball flourish in the UK. Things have improved but it's way off hitting most people's radar. I'd say, first point is if the kids play, the way the EB leagues are set means a lot of travel to play games and it's likely those players will be travelling to/from games unless they're at home so can't make all the games they might like. I know at Charnwood for example, there are just so many games and teams that they never have the time to go watch the Riders. They're practicing most days and some, like Holly Winterburn, had Charnwood Riders, WEABL, Loughborough Riders and WBBL games all going on so to try watch men's BBL as well just wasn't going to happen.
Otherwise... Basketball is a sport very different from others. If you're into football you support a team. You always have a favourite team. But in basketball I find it's often the case I ask someone who their favourite team is (NBA) and they don't have one, they say they're a "fan of the game" or a fan of particular players and prefer to play themselves or watch that one player. Because of that sort of fandom, it's difficult to sway those people to pick-up a team and really set their heart on those guys, especially when you just want the ball in your hands.
Percentage-wise I'd say in basketball, the fans of the game, a LOT more actually play or have played the game than in football, play or have played the game. Football has more armchair fans who aren't interested in playing.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 20, 2019 17:08:21 GMT
I genuinely believe the biggest problem for BBL clubs in building a fan base is the lack of foundation and stability. I got into British basketball aged 8, watching Thames Valley Tigers and also Kingston Wildcats. By the time I was 13, both clubs had folded. I then followed Guildford Heat but then they moved venue and rebranded and that ended my interest in the sport. It is ridiculous that a fan my age dropped off of the BBL’s supporter base and, to be honest, I didn’t hear much about the league until I decided to watch London Lions and London City Royals last season, having got the bug again following seeing games in Munich and Malaga. I ended up going to more Royals games as I will always associate Lions as being MK and a rival club to Tigers. And now it looks like Royals will be upping sticks and moving from Crystal Palace - I guess I was one of the few they managed to attract back as repeat customers. Forgive my self indulgence here but the problem will be true for anyone looking to get into the BBL. Even if you support a relatively solid club like Eagles or Riders, the league opposition as a whole is always so unstable and it doesn’t bode well IMO. Your timeline is a bit off. Kings morphed into Guildford in 92 and died in 94. Tigers died in 2005. I'm not being a pedant but that's not quite the churn you've described. And Heat moving within Guildford isn't any different to football clubs moving, stortford trebled my walk to a home game but I still go. I'm not sure why basketball clubs can't get solid, loyal fanbase. I'm not sure we're significantly worse that ice hockey, post professionalism rugby union or post sky rugby league when it comes to lon term consistency. But I do know what people seem to enjoy watching us, but don't come back.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 20, 2019 17:27:28 GMT
Thanks guys. A lot of this is way over my head but good to see such passionate insight. When the lions announce a squad, I may make the trek to Coppers Box to check them out.
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tvtigersfan
Rookie
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Favourite Team: Surrey Scorchers
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Post by tvtigersfan on Aug 20, 2019 20:11:13 GMT
I genuinely believe the biggest problem for BBL clubs in building a fan base is the lack of foundation and stability. I got into British basketball aged 8, watching Thames Valley Tigers and also Kingston Wildcats. By the time I was 13, both clubs had folded. I then followed Guildford Heat but then they moved venue and rebranded and that ended my interest in the sport. It is ridiculous that a fan my age dropped off of the BBL’s supporter base and, to be honest, I didn’t hear much about the league until I decided to watch London Lions and London City Royals last season, having got the bug again following seeing games in Munich and Malaga. I ended up going to more Royals games as I will always associate Lions as being MK and a rival club to Tigers. And now it looks like Royals will be upping sticks and moving from Crystal Palace - I guess I was one of the few they managed to attract back as repeat customers. Forgive my self indulgence here but the problem will be true for anyone looking to get into the BBL. Even if you support a relatively solid club like Eagles or Riders, the league opposition as a whole is always so unstable and it doesn’t bode well IMO. Your timeline is a bit off. Kings morphed into Guildford in 92 and died in 94. Tigers died in 2005. I'm not being a pedant but that's not quite the churn you've described. And Heat moving within Guildford isn't any different to football clubs moving, stortford trebled my walk to a home game but I still go. I'm not sure why basketball clubs can't get solid, loyal fanbase. I'm not sure we're significantly worse that ice hockey, post professionalism rugby union or post sky rugby league when it comes to lon term consistency. But I do know what people seem to enjoy watching us, but don't come back. Wildcats in the EBL, not Kings. Although my parents both supported Kings.
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Post by gloryeagle on Aug 20, 2019 21:27:35 GMT
But I do know what people seem to enjoy watching us, but don't come back. I must have taken upwards on 10 different friends along with me at various points over the years. Every one of them has enjoyed it - Still none of them follow the league.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 7, 2019 8:52:54 GMT
Went to my first game last night to watch London Lions and Cal Poly. Not what I expected from a pro team in London. Cal Poly is a weak program so beating them is hardly something to write home about
The atmosphere was a bit weird and the arena was pretty empty but I guess a pre season exhibition game like that is not representative of the real product. The team looked old and weak. Is that the highest standard in the UK?
I may go see another game during the season but not impressed so far. On a scale of 1 to 10, I’d give it a strong 4. Definitely room for improvement.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 7, 2019 10:19:28 GMT
Youre probably expecting something different to what you're getting. Think D league level not NCAA or nba
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Post by saintpat on Sept 7, 2019 11:42:11 GMT
Went to my first game last night to watch London Lions and Cal Poly. Not what I expected from a pro team in London. Cal Poly is a weak program so beating them is hardly something to write home about The atmosphere was a bit weird and the arena was pretty empty but I guess a pre season exhibition game like that is not representative of the real product. The team looked old and weak. Is that the highest standard in the UK? I may go see another game during the season but not impressed so far. On a scale of 1 to 10, I’d give it a strong 4. Definitely room for improvement. It's not a real game, no one cares much about the result, Lions had half a team & whilst I didn't go, I'm not sure I would have called the players old & weak but if you're comparing to NBA then perhaps you have a point. No idea on the numbers but Lions never open the top tier, I got the impression it was a decent enough crowd for a pre-season friendly & was probably more fans than Royals saw at any game last season(along with a few other clubs).
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Post by sporty on Sept 7, 2019 12:28:31 GMT
Dunkster. I hope you keep with it and experience more of the BBL. Visiting other arenas and teams should broaden you experience and hopefully it will give you as much enjoyment as it has me over the last 30 odd years
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Post by saintpat on Sept 7, 2019 12:42:39 GMT
Having seen another post about the game, it seems it was a good size crowd for a BBL crowd, 3 lower sides pretty much full. Agree with Sporty, visit some other venues but perhaps you need to set your expectations lower than you have at the moment & certainly make the next game a proper competitive game.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 7, 2019 13:10:11 GMT
I continue to wonder if this is a basketball kit...
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 9, 2019 21:24:56 GMT
I continue to wonder if this is a basketball kit... I'm convinced it is
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Post by interestedridersfan on Sept 10, 2019 19:59:15 GMT
I continue to wonder if this is a basketball kit... I'm convinced it is Same person who does Fozzie?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 10, 2019 21:45:14 GMT
Fozzie is locked in my shed. I'm feeding him - minus the big ginger beard - to the guinea pigs.
So not him.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 11, 2019 18:42:02 GMT
So I share my honest thoughts on my first game and now accused of being a basketball kit fellas??
C’mon! I call em like I see em. And that game was weak, very weak and if that’s what British ball is like then I feel sorry for you guys.
Came in with an open mind. No thank you!
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Post by interestedridersfan on Sept 11, 2019 19:04:50 GMT
So I share my honest thoughts on my first game and now accused of being a basketball kit fellas?? C’mon! I call em like I see em. And that game was weak, very weak and if that’s what British ball is like then I feel sorry for you guys. Came in with an open mind. No thank you! Nobody will be precious here about the quality of BBL. Providing you aren't a basketball kit. if you choose the lions as your team its a big arena for BBL basketball and will always be pretty empty And you chose a friendly as your first match. The competitive games will be way better quality.
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davetwt
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Post by davetwt on Sept 17, 2019 20:07:28 GMT
dunkster Vince will be pleased with your verdict lol
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Post by stevetheballer on Sept 18, 2019 9:52:17 GMT
There will definitely be better games to see as the season goes on. Although yes the standard is not the same as the NBA or other top leagues I have seen some epic games over the years and some really talented players.
I would suggest trying to get up to Newcastle to see the Eagles and the Riders in Leicester.
Both own their own arenas and they always have good crowds, the fans are close to the court as well and it creates a great atmosphere.
Outside of that Plymouth is good and Worcester was voted the best arena or something a little while ago, or was it best match night experience. Not sure but was something and am sure someone else could clarify that for me.
But definitely don’t give up on it and try more games.
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Post by notoriousbigz on Sept 18, 2019 9:57:42 GMT
So I share my honest thoughts on my first game and now accused of being a basketball kit fellas?? C’mon! I call em like I see em. And that game was weak, very weak and if that’s what British ball is like then I feel sorry for you guys. Came in with an open mind. No thank you! I don't think you're a basketball kit to be fair - its a more than conceivable concept that an American who hasn't really experienced professional basketball outside of the states (could be wrong there sorry if so!) would be wholly disappointed by a pre-season BBL game.
I think a 4/10 is a pretty accurate score if 10 is NBA level. Please do let us know if you go to a regular season game and what you think of it!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 18, 2019 12:29:04 GMT
So I share my honest thoughts on my first game and now accused of being a basketball kit fellas?? C’mon! I call em like I see em. And that game was weak, very weak and if that’s what British ball is like then I feel sorry for you guys. Came in with an open mind. No thank you! I don't think you're a basketball kit to be fair - its a more than conceivable concept that an American who hasn't really experienced professional basketball outside of the states (could be wrong there sorry if so!) would be wholly disappointed by a pre-season BBL game.
I think a 4/10 is a pretty accurate score if 10 is NBA level. Please do let us know if you go to a regular season game and what you think of it!
Gonna check out the other London team Royals on the 28th down in Crystal Palace. Hopefully will be better than my time at the Lions.
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Post by sporty on Sept 18, 2019 13:21:43 GMT
You will have different experiences at different venues. For example, Bristol is a small arena c650 people and the atmosphere can be very good Worcester, larger purpose built arena ( 1500/2000 seater) very professional set up and full most of the times with a good atmosphere. I do not think that you can summarise the BBL by just going to the London clubs
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Post by Steven McTowelie on Sept 18, 2019 14:17:46 GMT
Gonna check out the other London team Royals on the 28th down in Crystal Palace. Hopefully will be better than my time at the Lions. I doubt it will. Royals only came into existence last season and have had no success at all in attracting a fan base thus far. I imagine there'll be less at this game than there were at the Copper Box fixture you attended... And the roof might leak. A few things to bear in mind regarding the standard... Firstly, every BBL team experiences major player turnover almost every off season. For obvious reasons really. No one with an ounce of ambition wants to commit long term to a club at this level. Doesn't do wonders for early season cohesion on or off the court I'm sure. And some of the new signings will inevitably suck, get cut, and ultimately be replaced with better. Some rosters, including Royals' (who appear to only have six players announced currently) are still not complete. And with specific regard to the Lions fixture you attended, I imagine there's a very good chance they were missing some starters and playing mediocre veterans and young bench fillers far more minutes than they'd typically see in a competitive game. If the BBL's already on it's last life with you, I'd recommend just giving it a few months tbh. By then every team will hopefully have a fairly settled roster and the product should be quite a bit better. But if you're determined to give Crystal Palace a go, keep an open mind, expect to be unimpressed... And check the weather forecast before you set off.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 19, 2019 8:20:31 GMT
Gonna check out the other London team Royals on the 28th down in Crystal Palace. Hopefully will be better than my time at the Lions. I doubt it will. Royals only came into existence last season and have had no success at all in attracting a fan base thus far. I imagine there'll be less at this game than there were at the Copper Box fixture you attended... And the roof might leak. A few things to bear in mind regarding the standard... Firstly, every BBL team experiences major player turnover almost every off season. For obvious reasons really. No one with an ounce of ambition wants to commit long term to a club at this level. Doesn't do wonders for early season cohesion on or off the court I'm sure. And some of the new signings will inevitably suck, get cut, and ultimately be replaced with better. Some rosters, including Royals' (who appear to only have six players announced currently) are still not complete. And with specific regard to the Lions fixture you attended, I imagine there's a very good chance they were missing some starters and playing mediocre veterans and young bench fillers far more minutes than they'd typically see in a competitive game. If the BBL's already on it's last life with you, I'd recommend just giving it a few months tbh. By then every team will hopefully have a fairly settled roster and the product should be quite a bit better. But if you're determined to give Crystal Palace a go, keep an open mind, expect to be unimpressed... And check the weather forecast before you set off. Thanks for the info and will make sure to bring an umbrella just in case! I’m also looking to make some extra cash and wondering if anyone here know of any teams that are looking for some part time help? Skills development, marketing, anything where I could use my UCF experience to help teams in London.
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