sm11
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Post by sm11 on Apr 27, 2020 21:36:22 GMT
A big thank you to Hersey for pointing out the facebook page mentioned. Im using a magazine posted by Bryan Balser (a great 3 point shooter from the 90s) from September 1983 to decipher some of the gaps and question marks from those days. I will keep working my way through it and will let you know how i get on.
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Post by ko25 on Apr 27, 2020 21:59:08 GMT
A big thank you to Hersey for pointing out the facebook page mentioned. Im using a magazine posted by Bryan Balser (a great 3 point shooter from the 90s) from September 1983 to decipher some of the gaps and question marks from those days. I will keep working my way through it and will let you know how i get on. The links on your last previous post don't appear to work.  |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 27, 2020 22:09:27 GMT
Worked for me
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sm11
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Post by sm11 on Apr 27, 2020 22:41:19 GMT
They work in google chrome, they might not on IE.
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Post by ko25 on Apr 28, 2020 10:18:27 GMT
God knows what's going on there then it works on my phone but not my Mac. |
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Post by connors on Apr 28, 2020 14:21:18 GMT
A big thank you to Hersey for pointing out the facebook page mentioned. Im using a magazine posted by Bryan Balser (a great 3 point shooter from the 90s) from September 1983 to decipher some of the gaps and question marks from those days. I will keep working my way through it and will let you know how i get on. There’s a name from the past! I was on the wrong end of some seriously sided score lines to his East London Royals junior teams. They were stacked......we clearly were not! |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 28, 2020 21:01:17 GMT
Bryan's dad Derek was a bbl commisioner. Remember them? You must have played against David Attewell as well? Great bloke , I was writing about him for our history earlier today. Good to see he got a BE award this year, they got somethings right  |
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sm11
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Post by sm11 on Apr 30, 2020 6:44:11 GMT
Hello again. I have finnally sifted through all of what is on the facebook page Hersey mentioned. Ive filled in quite a lot of gaps and clarified a lot of question marks I had. O recommend that if you havent checked it out your self, then you should as it is incredible. Thank you so much for pointing it out Hersey. Im going to keep an eye on it. You are right that it is mostly photos (which are great as well) but there are some fantastic books, magazines, newspapers and documents that people have added. Bryan Balser (who is very active on it, which is so great to see as he was a top level player himself) uploaded a poster with all the div 1 tables up to 1991. One particular big contributor added the 'basketball reviews' of the early 80s which were very valuable sources. There were many other fantastic pieces of information as well.
Any way I have made updates to chapters 1, 2, 3, 4, 9 and 10. I have...
- discovered that my first attempt at the 75-76 mens division 1 was correct all along, even though I had a small doubt it may have been wrong
- my first attempt at the 77-78 mens division 1 was wrong, I have corrected this
- my first attempt at the 80-81 mens division 1 was wrong, although I was right about 1 discrepency, there was an error elsewhere in the table which i now have corrected
- it turns out my 85-86 mens division 1 table was slightly wrong. I had the tiebreak between Worthing and Solent the wrong way round (didnt see that coming) so I have corrected
- I have also found the 80-81 womens div 1 table, and had a first attempt (a very thorough one at that) at the 77-78, 78-79 and 79-80 tables all thanks to the basketball reviews posted on there
- I have now had a first attempt at the 79-80 mens div 2 table, again very confident in its accuracy
- Ive found all the tables for 90-91 as well
(Edits have been made to the chapters viewable on pages 1 and 2 of thread)
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sm11
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Post by sm11 on Apr 30, 2020 6:44:43 GMT
(Edits have been made to the chapters viewable on pages 1 and 2 of thread)
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sm11
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Post by sm11 on Apr 30, 2020 6:45:29 GMT
(Edits have been made to the chapters viewable on pages 1 and 2 of thread)
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sm11
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Post by sm11 on Apr 30, 2020 6:46:37 GMT
(Edits have been made to the chapters viewable on pages 1 and 2 of thread)
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Post by Deleted on Apr 30, 2020 7:54:40 GMT
Excellent stuff. Keep up the good work. If, on your travels, you find a link to the BBL team boxstats for Leopards can you pass it on please. I have most in the BBL handbooks but they don't reproduce very well.
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Post by ncdtb on May 1, 2020 17:01:51 GMT
Thanks for your previous help sm11. I've now entered all the results you helped with into my spreadsheet. I've since discovered a Derby Trailblazers WiKi page, which suggests we entered both the Cup and the Shield in 2003/04. Are you able to find these results via the Wayback machine? Those results, along with the Pool Stage of the Patron's Cup in 2005/06 are the only ones I'm missing now. The Wiki page is here: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Derby_TrailblazersThanks in anticipation. |
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sm11
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Post by sm11 on May 2, 2020 7:32:27 GMT
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Post by Deleted on May 2, 2020 8:45:24 GMT
Cheers. I should probably look harder
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Post by ncdtb on May 2, 2020 18:10:53 GMT
Cheers SM11 - your help has been invaluable. |
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sm11
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Post by sm11 on May 2, 2020 20:48:45 GMT
Hello again
I have updated to include the incomplete 2019-2020 season that has just gone by. I have left in the empty play off bracket to make it look that little bit more depressing. I have included a slight variation on the Division 1 table in which I have given Barking Abbey the 1 point they were missing from the miscalculation discussed at the beginning of the thread. This moves Barking Abbey above Leopards and into 11th (sorry Hersey).
I also updated to correct the Division names as they were incorrectly branded previously.
I have been keeping an eye on the english basketball facebook page everyday (well in fact about 20 times a day lol) in case some more tables show up to fill in any of the gaps from past seasons. If you have anything im missing or have noticed any mistakes ive made. Please let me know.
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Post by connors on May 3, 2020 14:31:23 GMT
Bryan's dad Derek was a bbl commisioner. Remember them? You must have played against David Attewell as well? Great bloke , I was writing about him for our history earlier today. Good to see he got a BE award this year, they got somethings right Yes he was in that team. I recall one thrashing they gave us when their starters left at half time to play for England later in the day..... I had the misfortune of also playing Emike Etetes Brixton teams at the same time too who went on to a successful BBL and I think England career. Amechi thankfully was in the north so avoided him! |
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starman
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Post by starman on May 3, 2020 15:36:36 GMT
As was Barry Gooch who is Balser's cousin. Think he might have played for Leopards also at some point.
Balser, Attewell and Stedroy Baker all still live in Derby now, after their playing careers ended. All good blokes.
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Post by Deleted on May 3, 2020 19:51:24 GMT
Didn't realise Barry was related to Bryan, or I did but have forgotten due to old age. Barry played for both versions of Ware (Stevenage) Rebels and I think he also had a spell at Palace (although that might have been Keith Pringle), he played for the new Leopards in our first season before retiring.
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Post by bluesuedeshoes on May 5, 2020 15:10:47 GMT
Hi, looking for some info on early days, anybody able to help?
First season teams in 1972 were decided by performance in the NIT. Final was contested by Liverpool All Star team and Sheffield Scorpions, Liverpool winners.
Does anybody know where this tournament was held? I remember it being at one location but an ex team mate recalls somewhere else. Won't name them yet in case it influences anyone who may have vague recollection.
Your link to Pawprint history starts in the first season and refers to the NIT but no mention of location.
Thanks.
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sm11
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Post by sm11 on May 5, 2020 18:02:07 GMT
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Post by Deleted on May 6, 2020 13:30:08 GMT
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sm11
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Post by sm11 on May 9, 2020 21:52:07 GMT
Hello again. I put a post out on the facebook page today asking for info today and got back the div 2 tables between 77-78 and 79-80. I have made updates to the chapters on pages 1 and 2 of the thread. Ive reordered the chapters slightly so that it makes more sense and generally tidied up my posts etc.
I am now only missing the 81-82 and 82-83 second division tables to complete the set for mens second tier. Again if you have a copy please let me know.
Hersey, you are right about the 02-03 tables on fix live. They dont add up, nor do the 05-06 tables, but the 03-04 and 04-05 info is generally quite good.
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sm11
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Post by sm11 on May 15, 2020 20:30:38 GMT
Hello again. Back with another doc I have made. This time I have been trying to revive/make my own version of the old Pawprint cumulative league table. For those who never came across it, it was basically a collective all time league table of all divisions since the formation of NBL in 1972. It was pretty fascinating and I thought it would be fantastic to look at a modern day updated version.
I had a go at defining how the clubs historys align but the sheer amount of clubs starting play and folding and moving and merging and buying each other out made it either impossible to apply a consistent approach or if it did then it looked nothing like how people consider it does. I was initially aiming to do one that only included the first division (old div 1/current day BBL) and second division (old div 2/conference/current day NBL1).
I slotted the first division results in first and that wasnt so hard. I started on the second division and it became a mess and I gave up.
If anyone is interested here is the first division part that I did complete. So here is an all time top flight (NBL1 72-87, BBL 87-now) british basketball league table. This includes this seasons incomplete one too by the way.
(Newer version now available later in thread)
Considering that MVP article someone posted earlier stating there maybe no BBL until 2021 then the following standings might be in place for a while maybe even set in stone forever when the BBA use this opportunity to sweep in and take over basketball in this country lol.
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